The Whole Parent Podcast
The Whole Parent Podcast
Picky Eaters (with @Kids.Eat.in.Color) #020
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Picky Eater Screener
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Have you ever felt like you're in a mealtime showdown with your toddler, armed with nothing but a spoon and the "wrong" color cup? Me too. Every day.
Today I'm joined by Jennifer Anderson of Kids Eat in Color to arm you with the strategies you need to turn mealtime battles into family building fun. We dissect the mystery behind toddler diets, discussing ways to make eating fun and how parents can lead by example to encourage adventurous food choices. This isn't just about getting peas onto their plate; it's about setting the foundation for a lifetime of healthy eating.
Let's be real—feeding a picky eater can feel like trying to solve a Rubik's cube blindfolded (where the colors change every meal). Jennifer and I get personal, sharing our own experiences with the challenges of nurturing diverse palates. We tackle the rainbow of eating behaviors from choosy to chowhound and offer a fresh perspective on introducing new foods. This chat goes beyond the plate, delving into how to build a positive body relationship with your kids, ensuring they grow up with confidence in their food choices and themselves.
Forget what you've heard about sugar and hyperactivity, or the myths that red dye is the root of all meltdowns. We're here to debunk these and other common misconceptions about kids' diets. Plus, we're dishing out practical tips like using micro portions and engaging kids in meal prep to encourage a more varied diet. By the end of our conversation, you'll have a toolkit filled with strategies to support your child in developing a healthy, resilient relationship with food—one joyful bite at a time. Join us on this culinary adventure and watch your little ones flourish into wholehearted, healthy eaters.
Just make it light, right, Because the more fun kids have, the more they relax. And when they're relaxed they're less likely to be anxious. And when they're less anxious, they're more likely to eat something. And they're watching you and they're having fun and you just ate this green bean in a really funny way. Maybe they want to do that too. Do not underestimate the power of a little bit of fun, and quote playing with food.
Speaker 2:Hello and welcome to the Whole Parent Podcast. My name is John. I am at Whole Parent on all of the social medias and this is a podcast all about how to raise kids who grow up to be resilient adults, who are resilient as kids, and to do so with confidence, because that is what most parents are lacking these days. All of us go on social media, or I guess some of us. If you're not on social media, you're probably doing great, but for those of us who go on social media, we constantly see all of these parents who seem like they have everything figured out, and I'm here to tell you that most of us do not. In fact, none of us have it all figured out, and this is a podcast that makes us parent maybe a little bit more effectively, maybe do things a little bit easier. And this episode, boy do. I have a treat for you today because I'm going to be joined by Jennifer Anderson, who is the creator of Kids Eat in Color, a social media account. She's a registered dietitian and she focuses on toddlers and eating and getting toddlers to eat healthy, well-rounded diets, not demonizing food, creating positive, lifelong relationships with food and eating, and she has so many amazing tips for us today. She's going to dispel some myths around toddler eating. She's going to give us some good advice. We talk about everything all the way up to red dye. Is that going to make your kid go nuts and bounce off the walls? Eating ice cream before bedtime? Is that going to make your kid not be able to fall asleep? How do I get my toddlers to eat broccoli? Literally all of that covered, and this is a really important episode for me. Let me just say that, and the reason for that is that this is one of my biggest struggles, and so if you're like I don't know how to get my kid to eat anything other than granola bars and pancakes and mac and cheese and chicken nuggets, you're right where I am. I am in the midst of this and I'm actually recording this intro a couple days after I did the interview with Jennifer. And let me just tell you, in the last five or six days, whenever I did that interview, it has been absolutely game-changing implementing the stuff that we're going to talk about in this episode. So if you are like me, if you struggle to have positive mealtime experiences where your kids eat diverse foods, colorful foods, fruits, vegetables, not just kind of a ton of sugar and carbs, then this is the right episode for you and I can't wait for you to hear from Jennifer and learn, like I did, and implement this stuff in your own parenting journey Because, like I said, it is absolutely transformative. Okay, I'm not going to break this episode in the middle to tell you about anything else, but at the end of the episode I am going to tell you how you can connect even better with whole parent.
Speaker 2:Going forward, let's get to Jennifer. Hello and welcome to the Whole Parent podcast. I am so excited for this episode. We are going to be joined by Jennifer Anderson. I'm a Swede. You'd think that I wouldn't trip over Anderson. Actually, that was. I don't know. We haven't talked about this, but that was actually my family name before they came over off the boat. They changed their name to Fogle. Later on they were Anderson's, so you're one of my kinsmen, that's right although I married into it.
Speaker 2:So your husband is one of my kinsmen that's right, um, but you know that we'll count it, and uh, yeah, so Jennifer Anderson man I almost did it who is better known as Kids Eat in Color on all the social media platforms. Jennifer, how are you doing today?
Speaker 1:I am great. Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 2:Yeah, for the super long conversation before we even started recording. You know, in the parenting space it's so fun Like so many of us get along so well that people are like, oh, it's so cool that you had that person on. I'm like, oh man, you think it was cool, it was like the most fun that I had all week.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, so it's, it's been good. But we're here talking about kids eating and I've done one podcast kind of solo on this. But I'm going to be totally on honest this is probably my biggest parenting. Like. I don't want to say weakness, insecurity. I'll say that I've shared openly how I'm still in the process of recovering from being a yeller and trying not to yell at my kids. I've shared openly about a lot of my parenting struggles, but one that I kind of maybe hide is that we really struggle to help our kids to eat in color. Our kids basically eat a color right now.
Speaker 1:Brown, brown or white.
Speaker 2:Sometimes brown and white. I'll give myself a white rice, you know, but yeah, brown, a lot of Z bars If you're familiar with those.
Speaker 1:My son discovered them. It's like if he had it his way, he would literally only eat Z bars. If you're familiar with those, my son discovered them. This is like if he had it his way, he would literally only eat Z bars.
Speaker 2:The problem is my kids do have it their way. So you know, I yeah. So this is like total transparency. This I kind of was this way with um consagra, the Dr Consagra on sleep. That's been a struggle for us too. But but, man, I have been so excited to get you on this podcast because this is going to be the episode where I ask all my questions.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so let's dive in, because you know what I have all the answers and everything I will say today absolutely works 100 of the time with my own children that's a crazy endorsement. I'm kidding.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:I'm completely sarcastic because I got into this because, 100%, I had the hardest time of my life feeding my kids, and I was a dietician and you can only imagine how I felt about that.
Speaker 2:No, I, I told okay, so I'm glad that you're. I was like, I was like, oh my gosh, is she being serious? Okay, so you're, you struggle too. So is this? This is just let's. Let's just hit the misconceptions right up at the front. Kids are picky eaters, true or false?
Speaker 1:True you. As we go through this conversation, you will see that I'm not like a true, false sort of person. I'm not a black and white sort of person. I think there's a whole rainbow in between black and white.
Speaker 2:So, so, in other words so many many many kids are picky.
Speaker 1:Um, yeah, many kids are picky. Not all kids are picky. Likely, if you're a parent, you know someone, you've got a friend whose kid is like who's you know kid eats, like, oh my gosh, all I did was I just did baby lead, lead weaning, and then my kids, they, they eat everything and I'm like, okay, tell me more. Or the friend whose kid sleeps 14 hours the day after they come from the home, from the hospital, and like that my brother.
Speaker 2:He's got five kids. I don't know what he's doing, but they all just sleep all the time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2:They have to like wake up their kid. They'll have like they actually have a new baby right now, but they're uh, him and his wife had a baby who's like the exact same age as my youngest and him and his wife they were like, oh yeah, we have to like wake him up to eat. He like won't wake up to eat and like that's like our biggest concern. I'm like come on, dude.
Speaker 1:I'm so sorry.
Speaker 2:Yeah, right, so yeah. So there are picky eaters. There are some kids who will eat, who will eat anything? Would you say that the majority, I mean you, you have what? 2 million followers, something. Yeah, I mean this is a big deal. It's a big deal. This is not like I'm alone and struggling with this, right.
Speaker 1:No, In fact, I started Kids in Color because I was standing in my pediatrician's office with my cute chubby nine-month-old that I was over the moon with and she looks at me and she's like he's not gaining weight. And I was, like you know, over the moon with and she looks at me and she's like he's not gaining weight, and I was like, wait a second. First of all, I almost fell on the floor because how, how is it possible? I'm a dietitian. Doesn't my kid know I'm a dietitian? No, he doesn't care.
Speaker 2:He doesn't care what I do.
Speaker 1:Doesn't he know how this is going to affect my reputation? No, he doesn't care whatsoever. Um, you know, he's like hey, I just learned how to walk, why eat? Uh? So that's when I was like, wait a second. Feeding kids must not be like what I learned in dietician school, which is like kids will just eat and stuff. Um, no, it's not that easy. And then my second son, you know, right off the bat, started showing all the signs of being a really complicated, extreme picky eater. And so I I mean I stood, I was standing in my kitchen, thinking, okay, I've got this picky eater, I have my son. And by that time I'd really specialized my knowledge in child feeding so that I could keep my, my first son alive. And you know, I'm standing there and I'm thinking I cannot be the only parent struggling.
Speaker 1:I can't be, and I started an Instagram page a couple months after. I had that thought, because I was like there have to be other parents out there who are really struggling and maybe I can take some of my suffering in this and help another parent. So it's not quite as hard, because this is my area of expertise supposedly, because this is my area of expertise supposedly, and if it's this hard for me, it's got to be this hard and even harder for other parents who don't even know what to Google when it comes to feeding their kid, you know.
Speaker 2:Well, and that's, yeah, I think that that's like what all of us do, right? So, like we just start Googling stuff and I've I probably have Googled this more than I've Googled most things right, and I would say that the information that you get is varied and the perspective that we've taken so far, which I think is a somewhat evidence-based, accepted perspective, is the primary goal of kids' dietary upbringing, child rearing as it relates to their palate, is to give kids a positive association with food and so for and with eating, because obviously, the prevalence of mental health, but even eating disorders, you know a lot of this, the stuff out there. Now you just think, well, I really don't want my kid to have a negative relationship with food and so I don't want to be, you know, speaking negatively about certain foods. I don't want to be, you know.
Speaker 2:And then you, you go down this like, okay, here's the checklist, every single time I have to eat dinner, which is I got to do all of these things, and oh, yeah, by the way, your kid has to enjoy every minute of it and and it just feels like maybe, maybe I'm wrong for this. I don't know, but I've gotten to the point where I'm like this is just not going to be the battle that I fight, like if I fight every battle as a parent, you know this has got to be. I have to like give somewhere, and so I'm just not. And so my kids, yeah, like Z bars, sandwiches, toast, you know like that's, that's a lot of their diet and we've tried different things, but it just feels like, yeah, it just feels impossible.
Speaker 1:Sorry, um, I'm recovering from this cold that my child gave me and was over in three days and I'm, you know, still trying to recover three and a half years later, um, later. So yeah, I totally hear you and I always like to remind parents, it's not that this stuff doesn't matter. Whatever this stuff is the feeding, the sleeping, the, you know, you name it.
Speaker 2:The keeping your house. Yeah, the hitting, the hitting. I'll add that one the tantrums, right, they matter.
Speaker 1:It's not that it doesn't matter, but it's that you can choose what matters to you and what you are actually going to do something about.
Speaker 1:You don't have to care about whether your child eats quote too many Z-bars, whatever that means. You don't have to. I mean, it's not that it doesn't matter, but also you get to decide does this matter enough to me that I'm actually going to do something about it or not? And parents can be confident in that. Like, you get to make the rules about what's important to you. It's just true. And so, if you're, you know, a lot of times parents listening to various conversations they're like, oh my gosh, I have to do this or my child's going to be scarred forever. Like, I'm sorry, your child is not going to be scarred forever. It's just not true. Kids are not that fragile and whether they really love you know some other bar other than that particular one, it doesn't matter.
Speaker 2:This is not an endorsement for Z Bars right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely not. I'm surprised I'm even using the name, because I'm so careful about not branding things.
Speaker 2:I know, I know, you know, I would like. I'll just say, like I don't, I'm not a particularly big fan of these right.
Speaker 1:I'm not saying like you know, I'm just saying like I don't know why, but like it's all my kids will eat. But they're cookies in a bar. It doesn't mean they're bad. It doesn't mean they're bad just because it's a cookie, but it just means it is a cookie. Let's not, let's not like make up something and say, oh, this is not a cookie, it just is.
Speaker 2:I like that. Instead of calling foods good and bad, I'm just going to start referring to foods as cookie and not cookie. Is this a?
Speaker 2:cookie, that's a piece of toast with a full two tablespoons of cinnamon sugar on it. I think that's a cookie. It's a cookie we're going to go with cookie. That's. That's a really helpful. But I think, yeah, yeah, I think, knowing what you just hearing, that I think is so, and this is something I try to do on every podcast, especially with guests is to say, like you know, as you said, we don't have to care about everything and we're probably not going to scar our anti-fragile kids for life, right like our kids are anti-fragile, and so a lot of the stuff that I talk about unrelated to food is okay If your kid falls off the slide, like probably good for them.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Right Like letting your kids right Okay.
Speaker 2:Okay, so you're, you're, you're right with me.
Speaker 1:I mean, obviously it depends on your kid and all this stuff, but my kid got his first bloody nose at six months old Cause he tried to climb down the stairs face first. But guess what, he never did that again.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, and I was right there.
Speaker 1:I was right there to help him get better.
Speaker 2:And no, it's. It's all about resilience, Right, and so I. But I think, with things like food and you know, I'm even identifying that this is like a. This is a shame point or maybe a fear point for me where, yeah, I feel like, but this will scar him or scar them All. All of my kids are boys, so I'm just, I just say him and I just mean all three Um, it will scar them for life because, because it feels like man if I really really make a big stink about this. So so just to give you some context, we tried the I don't again, this is not a branding, I won't even mention the brand.
Speaker 2:We tried one of the meal service things where it's like a preheated, like you just have it in your freezer, you just throw in the microwave and it's supposed to be all stuff like fun shapes, colors and it's just like you just order like however many in a box and you just like try and see if that'll be. It's supposed to be diet, you know, nutritionally rich. My kids, but it was like I was my my middle son would literally just say dad, why are you being so mean right now when I like pulled one out of the freezer, why are you being so mean right now? So I I really feel like, yeah, I'm, I'm at a loss. So what can we do? If? If we do care Cause I think we care Like the interesting thing is the different battles that we choose.
Speaker 2:Like sleep is one that we've basically been like we don't, we're not really going to care. Every, every every sleep expert that I've talked to has been like it comes out in the wash at seven. So, like you know, at seven, eight, nine years old, whether you did this or that, your kid is going to, they're going to kind of even out with with food. It seems a little different in that the more foods that they seem to be exposed to and I've heard you say this in various forms like the kind of the easier transition it's going to be to developing that palate later, so, yeah, I mean there is a.
Speaker 1:There is a decent amount of research that shows that. You know, early exposure to wider variety of foods tends to lead to kids eating more different foods over time, so it's not like it doesn't matter. At the same time, you know, are there any foods that you've learned to eat as an adult that you were never exposed to as a child?
Speaker 1:I mean I never ate feta cheese as a child. Sure, it was like three times the cost of, like you know, generic block of cheese. Why, you know, we did not have very much money. I never tasted anything other than cheddar cheese. Why, you know, we did not have very much money. I never tasted anything other than cheddar cheese. Right? So have I learned to like it? Yeah, cause it's fun, but it's not. You know, we learn to eat things as an adult. Um, kids can learn to eat things. That said, it doesn't mean you should never expose your kids to stuff, because I like to remind parents, if your kid doesn't see it, they're not going to eat it because, literally, it's not even there. It's not there.
Speaker 1:So if you're, like, I want my kid to eat broccoli, but they didn't ever eat it, so I never serve it. Well, like you got to serve it, it has to be there for them to be able to eat it. So when I approach this sort of picky eating, when I'm thinking about long-term eating competence, what do I really want from kids? I want them to have a good relationship with their body, and that has several different facets. It means one I am. I have a good relationship with my body. Like, whatever size it is, whatever it's doing, I have an appreciation for it. I can live in it. I'm not, you know, hating my body or trying to make drastic changes to it. You know that sort of thing, but also it's keeping my body healthy. There is an element of what we eat does affect our health in some ways. Like you, take the example of a kid with allergies. Well, a good relationship with food for a kid with allergies is literally to never eat that, the allergen that could have a very drastic impact on them.
Speaker 1:So also, if you have a kid who never ever ever eats a fruit or vegetable, they're actually pretty high risk for things like scurvy, which, you know, on one hand, people are like what?
Speaker 2:That's like why are you using the word scurvy? That seems insane to me, Like my kids are going to get like a pirate disease here.
Speaker 1:Right, the pirate disease. Believe it or not, we are seeing increases, increasing rates of scurvy, which is easy. It's like crazy. So when I say it matters, it's like it does matter if your child ever eats fruits or vegetables. If they're not, then that's something that you may want to pay attention to. You may need to find a way to like get a supplement into them, or something like that.
Speaker 2:Sure.
Speaker 1:At the same time, um, you know. So we want them to have a good relationship with their body in terms of mindset, in terms of of their physical body, in terms of maintaining its health and getting it enough, you know, getting it what it needs. It doesn't mean you have to be on some like sort of like longevity diet where your kid has to be obsessed with every single thing they put into their mouth in the hopes they'll live to, you know, 150 years old. But we do want to maintain some sort of level of health, right, if we can. So when we're thinking about long-term eating competence, like can my child tell if they're hungry or full? Can they honor those feeding cues? Are they using food to soothe themselves, to handle emotions, to do these sorts of things? Like I'm a big appreciator of. Like hey, I can eat some potato chips and that will make me happy for a short time. I think that's amazing. I think that's a great tool. At the same time, if that's my only tool, that's actually not healthy. It's not healthy if I can't handle my emotions other than eating potato chips.
Speaker 1:So we want kids to be able to take care of themselves and to have an appropriate relationship with food. That's, you know, it's fun, it's connection, it's experiencing the world, it's, you know, it's maybe even learning how food is grown. There's so many things that are around food. We don't want to add all sorts of emotional baggage on top of it where we're like oh now you're good or bad based on whether you ate X, y, z, number of Z bars or not, or, you know, like whatever it is.
Speaker 1:So we want them to end up as adult who can eat enough foods to meet their nutrition requirements and who can enjoy the wide variety of experiences that go along with food. And they can, you know. They can enjoy their bodies, they can go to a social event and get what they need. They can go to camp and eat food there. So we want kids to be able to grow into competent eaters, not necessarily kids who are going to be those you know, super adventurous kids who eat absolutely anything, anywhere, anytime. I don't have those kids, you don't have those kids.
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 1:You know? No, the parents listening to this episode probably don't have those kids.
Speaker 2:Sure Well, and if they do, they might not be listening to this episode, right, they might be like, oh yeah, this is just not my struggle and I think, yeah, I think that that just to hear you talk about that, as, like, the person who makes the videos, is so affirming to me at least I would hope it's affirming to the listeners as well, because for me I mean, yeah, we talk about not creating this good and bad relationship with food, and I remember growing up, right I will say, as a guy raised in a kind of fairly educated environment with enough resources, I was very privileged that food was not demonized for me, but certainly for members of my family, especially women who grew up a lot earlier than I did grandparents I would hear things like like I was bad because I ate and I knew somehow intrinsically that if I did it it wouldn't make me bad because I was different than them in some way.
Speaker 2:But you know, I think that that extreme is like. That's what I think we all fear ultimately is like, if I put broccoli up in front of my kids too many times, are they going to like develop an eating disorder? And the answer is no. Kids are anti-fragile.
Speaker 1:The answer is no.
Speaker 2:And but I think that's a real there's a lot of fear-based messaging. Yes, yeah, I think there's a lot of fear-based messaging.
Speaker 1:The messaging I was. So part of Kids Eating Color for me has always been trying to dispel this sort of fear-based messages that like okay, if your kid eats candy, they're going to get cancer. No, you know, if your child gets cancer it's not your fault because you fed them some candy. Sure, there's all these sort of like really extreme messages that cause guilt and fear everywhere, everywhere, and so much of my efforts over the years have been like we don't have to be fixating, obsession, obsessing about this good food, bad food thing. It's. It's more complicated than that. There's a lot more nuance.
Speaker 1:But for the first time I am now having to also add on this like common sense, nuanced approach to the sort of like anti-diet, kids intuitive eating stuff where all of a sudden there are especially this past around easter, when everybody's creating their candy content, like people are literally saying, well, do you want your child to eat a little bit less sugar now or do you want to give them an eating disorder? And I was like this is unacceptable. It is unacceptable to pay any foods in this crazy sort of fear-based thing of like if you feed them the bad foods, they're going to have a lifelong thing. The same for relationship with food Giving. Making your child telling them, hey, you can only eat two pieces of candy is not going to give your child an eating disorder.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:I just want to be really really clear about that.
Speaker 2:Like well, and if you're, if you're so concerned about that well, if you're really concerned, I think. I think part of it is that we're we look for causation. What we find is correlation, and, and so you know, do kids have an increased prevalence of eating disorders today?
Speaker 1:Yes, oh my gosh, it is. It's like skyrocketing. That's also true it didn't.
Speaker 2:It didn't happen 25 years ago and your parents let you eat whatever you wanted. So maybe it's, maybe it's not, that your parents said it was different when your parents said, have two pieces of candy on Halloween and then save the rest for tomorrow, somehow you didn't develop an eating disorder. Maybe there's a thing called social media and there's a thing called, you know, like neural pathways in the brain that are not, that are, that are geared and primed to try and you know, look, look at the highest, best good for society, and to look at these things and like there's so many more factors. And so I do think it's you know, a lot of why I built whole parent. You've kind of said how, why you built kids eat in color.
Speaker 2:A lot of why I built whole parent in part was to come to combat the fact that we do have to parent a little bit more intentionally, I think, in the age of social media. And so, even if we do have to be a little bit more conscious of the ways in which we communicate about food, it's not to say that one you say it wrong this time, or you've done this for 10 years that it's going to ultimately lead to your kid having anorexia or something else you know, or being a binge eater, like that won't necessarily be the case, and I think that you saying that openly is really helpful and and and you know there's I think that there's the there's like the three. There's the three headed dragon of this on social media, which is that there's the population of people who are like, have no restrictions at all, which which, ultimately, functionally, I'm, I'm in, I just keep it out of the house, like, if I don't want my kids to have a hundred M&Ms, I'm not going to buy a gigantic bag of M&Ms.
Speaker 1:So let me tell you this what you're doing is you're practicing covert restriction, which is an evidence-based practice and is associated with better child health, great relationship with food and everything.
Speaker 1:So let me just let you know you're literally doing the best thing. So let me just let you know you're literally doing the best thing. If you don't, right? When your child doesn't know they're being restricted, all this drama like is left behind, right, because they don't realize. Like if your two-year-old has never had something and you keep it away from them, they're not missing anything. This is covert restriction and it's actually associated with great things. Now, once your child knows about it and if they're like hey, I want M&Ms, I want M&Ms and you're like no, those are bad.
Speaker 1:All of a sudden, you've brought in like a whole bunch of things. If you're like, hey, no more of those bars, they're not good for you, they're cookies. Cookies are bad for you. You can only have so many cookies. All of a sudden, you've brought in all this emotional baggage to this conversation and it becomes much more complicated. Instead, if you say, hey, we're going to buy this box of bars once a week, it's this much money. I want to spend more money on other things. We need a variety of foods. We need lots of foods, because every single food does something different in our body. All of a sudden, you have just told your child, hey, we need a variety of foods. You've given them a totally different perspective and you've given them the really important information that every food is going to do something different in their body. And you've said nothing about how these bars are bad or cookies are bad or anything else.
Speaker 1:What I'd like to remind parents of is serving a variety of foods. It is important and what that means to you is going to be different in different seasons. Like, let's say, you're a mom, you're in your first trimester. Like variety for you could be different varieties of crackers. Oh yeah, oh yeah, oh yeah for nutrition status, for your kid's palate, like all that stuff. And so, as you're thinking, oh, I want to serve a variety of foods, I want to expose my kid. That is how your child is going to get used to more foods and they're going to, you know, learn to learn to eat more foods. But it doesn't mean we have to be bad mouthing other foods. You can make the decision not to have, I don't know, cupcakes in your house. You can make that decision without saying anything bad about cupcakes.
Speaker 2:And it also. Then it creates social pressure too for your kids, right, and this is something that we talk about. I mean, this goes way beyond food. The thing is, with food is food's so culturally tied that when you start to bad mouth cupcakes, right, and then you have a friend at school who brings cupcakes and then your kid says, no, you're bad. Like people don't even understand how this is not. This is. This goes beyond eating disorders, like when you, when you may not cause your kid to have an eating disorder by bad mouthing cupcakes, but you may cause social pain for some other kid when your child comes out and says you're wrong and you're bad.
Speaker 1:Right. I get so many teachers who are like oh, this kid said that XYZ food is poison. When you, um, when parents say, oh my gosh, those school lunches, those are so unhealthy, I cannot tell you how passionate I am about saying you should never. And the time you should I use the word should so few times? You should never, ever, in front of your child, bad mouth school lunches.
Speaker 2:Never, because what they do is they stigmatize kids.
Speaker 1:And what you don't realize is those children then don't eat school lunch. When they need that nutrition in their life they skip it. The older they get, the more they skip the lunch because of the stigma. It's completely unacceptable. So I mean that's like a big nerve for me. Like you can in your family say, hey, this food is not for us. Like I don't know, maybe maybe you follow a religious food code we're all vegetarians.
Speaker 1:Maybe it's your preference, maybe you don't believe in having too much sugar, right, that's fine, but it doesn't mean you need to be bad mouthing it, right? Yeah, well, so we're-. That's where the drama comes in, because there is some research showing that when you are saying, hey, these foods are bad versus good, that actually does add to, you know, disordered eating risk. Right Now there's all sorts of other things. It's like oh, you know, if you restrict your kid from two cookies versus three or unlimited, like, we can get into all that drama of like restriction and all that stuff. But I do feel like there's enough research out there to really make the recommendation to parents to say don't call it bad or good, like, call it by its name.
Speaker 1:We have this amazing vocabulary for food. Every food has its own name. Use that vocabulary. Don't try to parse it together and say, oh, these are the good foods and these are the bad foods. It's much more complicated than that. Is that helpful? And it can lead to like your child saying, oh, my gosh, I ate this unhealthy food. Am I a bad person? Is my friend bad? Is my friend's mom serving them poison? Because these are the messages that are going to school and now, all of a sudden, rather than being an agent of curiosity or acceptance or learning about other people, now your kid is going around spreading judgment about food, like oh my gosh, that's a bad food. Is that really the first thought that we want children to have when they look at their friend's lunch is is that healthy or not? Is that really what we want for our kids? Or do we want them to look at the lunch and say oh, what do you have?
Speaker 2:Well, that seems disordered to me. To me to say, like when a kid is so, like I didn't know what was healthy and not healthy when I was a kid and I probably really. I mean, like I said, there were some casual comments that I that that definitely existed and I you know the way that families work I don't know how much eating disorder existed. I have suspicions now, knowing much more about psychology as an adult, that it was probably more than I thought in my extended family. But yeah, we didn't have any of that kind of language in my own home. And just to give you an example, so we don't eat meat, we're vegetarians. My kids are also vegetarians. Maybe that's part of the issue, you know, I just trying to justify that. You know chicken nuggets are also brown, so it's not probably doing. They still would only be eating brown things. But but yeah, so so they'll have like impossible chicken nuggets or something like that. But but yeah, we don't eat. They don't really like that, because those are designed to imitate meat and because they've never been exposed to meat, they're like so what? Um, and the kids next door, his best friends, uh, they are Jordanian and they're Muslim and they I don't know how closely they keep halal, but like, for sure, they have a lot of lamb. They like they eat a lot of meat.
Speaker 2:And just trying to process with my seven-year-old even, like, yeah, they're not bad for eating something that we choose not to eat. And if you choose to eat that, that's okay. Here are our reasons, not for not, but they, but those reasons may not even be on their radar, right. And so so he, he, he's kind of internalized this. Like yeah, I think it's. I personally don't think I think it's kind of gross to this. Like, yeah, I think it's, I personally don't think I think it's kind of gross to me to think about eating an animal, but I get that they don't think it's gross. And so he sits a table with them and we'll, like you know, eat and I think that's what slices of white bread, while they know we want kids.
Speaker 1:We want kids to have that sort of maturity and some kids are going to pick that up easier than others.
Speaker 1:I mean one of my kids, you know he's not picking up that sort of like the subtle distinction much more willing to say, like, whatever's on the top of his head and you know, with little kids you never know what's on the top of their head, but I think that's so true. Like we don't. It's not a child's job and it's not developmentally appropriate for a child to be expected to make some sort of health decision based on what's at the on the table at a party.
Speaker 1:Like that is not. That is not for them to be making that call. It is their job to sit at your table, to sit at their own table at home and to say, okay, my parents put these foods on the table. Or maybe sit at their own table at home and to say, okay, my parents put these foods on the table, or maybe even on my plate and I'm going to choose which one of these to eat and which ones not to eat. Right, and that is developmentally appropriate because, just like with everything, you, the parent, are setting the boundary. You're deciding what is there. That's your job. You can spend as much time as you want reading up on like nutrition books or whatever. It is Right, but that's not your child's job. It's not their job to like carry that burden in this sort of weird food environment that we have, where there is a lot of food that if you just eat that food you're actually your health might suffer, right, but that's not their problem.
Speaker 2:That's our problem to deal with.
Speaker 1:That is not their problem. So for us to put that on children, it's just not appropriate, like why we we don't need to be doing that. Instead, we need to be cultivating this sense of like. Are they hungry? Are they full? Are they? Does that look good to them? Does that not? Because what they're doing is they're they're, you know, trying to listen, like what is their body saying, and that's an important skill, not just in eating but in everything. Like what's your gut saying? What are you, you know, listening to.
Speaker 1:You know that feeling you have when there's some weirdo, you know, on the on the street watching you, you know, or whatever, like I think I should run inside and go talk to my parents.
Speaker 1:It's all part of the same system of like being able to kind of tell what those internal senses are. It's all part of the same system of like being able to kind of tell what those internal senses are. So teaching kids to have that at the table, even if it means they're looking at that broccoli and they're deciding not to eat it, we see that as bad, but also them deciding not to eat it is also a skill right, interesting, and the more that we expose them to broccoli, the more they realize oh, that's actually okay, it's okay for me to eat it, it's okay for me to poke it, touch it, whatever, and then I might decide to try it. That's great. But what we're doing is we are helping them become comfortable to the point where they're like oh, this is actually not a threat to me Because kids are scared of new foods. That is actually a thing. It's got a name neophobia. I'm afraid of new foods, I'm afraid of new things, and this happens to me, you know, related to food.
Speaker 1:But what we are trying to do is help them become comfortable. Like in our Better Bites program, parents are always like, well, what's the eating plan? It's like nope, it's not the eating plan, right, if you've got a computer, it's not the eating plan, it's not the foods, it's all about. Can we help your child's body become comfortable? Can we help you create an environment that's going to help them become comfortable? And I think that's where we start to see okay, what is my real goal? My real goal is to help my child become comfortable in the presence of variety and be able to meet their nutrition needs. You know, it's not some sort of like how do I help them get eat every single food or have this? You know, I don't know, have this sort of relationship with food where you're like oh, whatever you want, anytime, anywhere, any place, there's a balance right.
Speaker 1:As a parent, we can set those boundaries around eating Like you can decide. You know what? I'm just not going to have bags of M&Ms in the house. I mean that just doesn't feel right to me. It's not good for my kids, it's not good for me.
Speaker 1:Right, it's not good for you. Whatever, it is Right. And there's some people who are like, oh well, that means you need to have more M&Ms in the house and that means you may need to make them, you know, available and, like you know, for some kids that may be an appropriate intervention. We have to remember that some parents do have disordered eating or they have a real eating disorder and the best thing for that family is, yeah, we are always going to have M&Ms, we're always going to have them in the cupboard and they're always going to be available, and that is literally what is the best thing possible for that family. Well, I don't have an eating disorder, my husband doesn't have an eating disorder and in my family, having unlimited amounts of M&Ms all the time like we could, but like that's just not what happens.
Speaker 1:Right. And so there are variations on kind of this balance of like giving kids unlimited eating opportunities, also saying you know this isn't always going to be in the house and that's all okay. But I think we need to keep our eye on the big things, which are can your child tell when they're hungry and full and what their body wants? Are you providing as much variety as you can? And also I just throw this in there Is your child like typically eating or do they actually have like a really like more serious issue, because there are times when parents are like I've done everything, my kid is only eating 10 foods. That's not typical for a child to only only eating 10 foods. That's not typical for a child to only be eating 10 foods or 15. Right.
Speaker 2:Well, unless that's all they're being offered.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and there are times when you're like, wait a second, there's more going on here for my child beyond all these other things, cause I'm doing everything everybody is saying and nothing is adding up, so also keep that in mind. We actually have a picky eating screener for parents to take.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's great.
Speaker 1:I can help them figure out like okay, does my child have typical picky eating or is it something more?
Speaker 2:Is it beyond that?
Speaker 1:Yeah, cause we do find that's such a common question that we get specifically about picky eating that we want to make sure parents are not flipping out about something that's really pretty typical. Um, you know cause? There's no reason to be laying awake at night If your toddler is only eating two bites of dinner every night. Cause that's what toddlers do, it's so common. Like you don't have to be losing sleep over that.
Speaker 2:Um yeah, Okay, so I have. I have a bunch of myths that I want to kind of rapid fire on you, but before I do that, I just want to say, for like, I feel like I'm sitting here having a Eureka moment, because what you're saying about food is so just. I don't know why. I've never thought of it this way, but this is so reflective of just kind of everything in childhood, which is all of the stuff that we talk about with giving kids opportunities to try things and fail, giving kids opportunities to be exposed to things, not being unnecessarily afraid of unknowns not be but understanding that kids are naturally afraid of unknowns because of their, you know. I like to say that the brain is just trying to predict what's coming next. Right, Like that's essentially what your brain is doing is just trying to predict what's coming next.
Speaker 1:We also don't want them eating the random mushrooms in the yard.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 2:And so kids and kids, because they, because they don't have as much information as us and they don't have the predictive ability, they don't know that just because you know Brussels sprouts also have salt and were prepared in the same way that the broccoli was, that they're probably going to like both, or maybe not, but at least let's find out. Like they may not have that ability. So so a lot of this stuff is lining up and, and especially when you just said you know we want them to be able to trust their own sense of the world. I think, when I'm just thinking about my own kids, I have given them so many tools out in the world to trust the sense of the world, but at the dinner table I feel like we're not doing that at all. We're making the decisions for them. You're, you're probably not going to like this, you probably are going to like this, and the idea that, like I would prepare something and my kids would poke at it and then not eat it, to me is like then I failed, instead of saying no. And this is what I would say in every other aspect. Like no, sending your kid out onto the tee ball field to like totally mess up and totally not hit the ball and then not shielding them from that experience, but also processing it with them. That's good parenting, oh yeah, and I think so many parents are afraid not only of saying the wrong thing about food, not only of you know certain foods Now I mean, which are some of my myths here but but not only some of those things, but also of the world. Right, like we're all terrified.
Speaker 2:I talk about this in the book that I that I just got, just got to copy edit phase, but yeah, thank you, um, but I just got, yeah, just got to copy edit phase, and one of my chapters is is about boundaries, but then also like where we probably need to have fewer boundaries, and one of those is like I, I don't say this in specifics, but stranger danger is not like particularly healthy for kids, because when they get into this stranger danger idea, then they think all strangers are dangerous, when in reality, your goal should be to foster that internal sense of here are the things that you look for that are problematic, strange behaviors, and then don't, don't put yourself in positions, right? So, so like I think the same is true. It sounds like the same is true with food, which is like man I'm telling my kids essentially I'm trying to shield them from from all harm and then what they wind up with and this is what we now know of kids who are brought up to fear the world, whether that's falling off the slide, whether that's the strangers on the street, whether that's being outside of an arm's length from mom or dad out in public, which a lot of parents are like. We got to keep them within arm's length at all times and within arm's length at all times.
Speaker 2:When kids grow up to be afraid of those things, they grow up into adults that are highly anxious and often are depressed. On the flip side, when your kid grows up kind of demonizing food and having to judge every single food is this poison, is this not? I imagine they're probably going to grow up with a pretty anxious relationship to food and a pretty anxious relationship. When you said it's not developmentally appropriate, I was like, oh man, that's all the stuff we talk about with fear. So thank you so much for that. That's just my like rambling thoughts, but I feel like this has also been super helpful for me, because it seems like a lot of the stuff we talk about in parenting spaces. If we just applied that to food and weren't so scared, then maybe actually we'd be much more successful. Okay, so here's my myths. Rapid fire Isn't a myth, is it not? First one, you're going to get canceled for this, I know, but I'm going to put you on the spot.
Speaker 1:I'm going to put you on the spot. But I'm going to lie.
Speaker 2:I mean I know, right, okay. So first one we used to feed our kids these green smoothies that were absolutely chocked full of spinach and all of these people and they, like, didn't have a ton of sugar. They were just like maybe frozen pineapple, but otherwise, and like an apple, maybe an orange, but it was like fruit, fresh fruit, um, and it was like spinach, water and a couple of pieces of fruit. People on the internet were like John, you're going to give your kids some form of cancer from having too much spinach, too much spinach, oh my gosh.
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay. So that is the too much spinach idea, is it so? Spinach has what are called anti-nutrients, and this is not just spinach, it's all kinds of foods. Vegetable foods have these more. They, um, they compete in your body for other things, so like iron absorption, calcium absorption, like all sorts of elements. Your body is competing for absorption because you only have so many ways to like get it into your body. So spinach doesn't have very good absorption of, say, iron and some other things because it's so high in these nutrients. It doesn't mean it's not healthy. It for sure is not going to give your kid cancer. Like, let's get's get off. The spinach is going to kill us. Train totally unhelpful. Should your child only be eating spinach?
Speaker 2:No, sure, sure, sure, sure, but. But a spinach, but a green, a green juice once a day. Not harmful to your kids, Probably good for them.
Speaker 1:No, no, If your child has anemia or something like that, I would serve that green smoothie at a time by itself, and then you know the rest of the day serve your high iron foods. But like seriously, a green smoothie every day is not going to hurt your kid. It might help your kid, Okay.
Speaker 2:Number two red dye.
Speaker 1:Oh, red dye. I don't understand why people are not more concerned about yellow five personally, but because there's way more evidence.
Speaker 2:You're saying there's more to fear.
Speaker 1:So here's, here's the thing Do dyes affect kids? They affect some kids. That's what the research shows. I don't think we should be making up stuff to say, oh, it doesn't matter. It does matter actually, and for some kids it can increase all sorts of symptoms behavioral symptoms, ability to handle just about anything. It might cause tantrums, it may cause allergic reactions, like all sorts of things. This is true. It is true for a way smaller group of children than is being portrayed on social media, and I wish I had had my stat like right in front of me Um, but I don't, so I'm not going to give you a number, but it is way smaller, way, way, way, way, way way smaller than you would think Like over over under 10%.
Speaker 1:Ah, that's what I'm trying to remember. Is it over or under 10%?
Speaker 2:Okay, so it's okay, but, but, but under 25.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, I'm again. I don't want to put a number out there. I do have a highlight about food dye on my Instagram page and that has actual data in it. Um, one of my kids I never worry about dye, the other one we actually suspect is sensitive to food dye and so we just generally don't have it around because he seems to act super weird when he has it. But you know what?
Speaker 2:call me crazy right, call me crazy, but I feel like a lot of the red food diet stuff is like your kid goes to a party. They have a cupcake with pink frosting. They come home and you treat them totally differently, knowing that they've had the red dye.
Speaker 1:Oh, absolutely.
Speaker 2:And kids will absolutely. Kids look to us to to understand their experience of the world because we are. The more regulated in their mind should be, the more regulated you know parent child relationship and co -regulation, and so I think a lot of parents like because that happens? This is why it's so damaging to to tell your child not to trust their emotions. You're not hungry right now? Right, because they'll believe you Like. They'll actually be like yeah, you're right, I must not be, because you must know more than me about this. The same thing is true, I think, with the red dye thing. It's interesting to find out that there is some validity to it. I'm willing to accept the data. Right, it's not totally made up, but at the same time I think overblown.
Speaker 1:I mean, why do we have it? It seems stupid that it's in there, especially since it does affect some kids, but you're, but you're right and you would love the data on like does sugar make your kid hyper? Oh, no, no no, it doesn't that was actually.
Speaker 2:That was my next parent.
Speaker 1:I've never met a parent in real life who's like oh yeah, I could totally see that. They're like no, no, and I'm like there are so many studies that have compared parents and they give the kid like the Kool-Aid that actually has sugar in it, the Kool-Aid that doesn't. And if the parents think they're sugar, they rate their kids behavior more hyper, you know, just because that's what they think. So, no, sugar isn't making your kid hyper, unless your child has some sort of sensitivity to high sugar levels, and that is true for some kids, but, again, an exceedingly small number of children. So again, do your own experiments.
Speaker 1:You think your child has a sensitivity to food dye Take it all out for two weeks. The sensitivity to food dye take it all out for two weeks. Give them a huge dose, see what happens and, if possible, have some sort of other person, like a teacher who doesn't know who doesn't know, because your kid is sensitive. There's a good chance they're not, but maybe they are so, and this goes for literally anything. Like anything is possible. Your kid could literally have anything.
Speaker 2:So this is getting so you're already hitting my next one, but I want to ask it overtly If my kid has ice cream before bed, is it going to keep them up and ruin their bedtime routine, provided that it's not part of the bedtime routine? So like if I do my normal bedtime routine, as I normally would, at 630, but whether or not they have ice cream at 615, effect no effect or, most of the time, one or the other.
Speaker 1:Okay. So I'll give you this example. My, we did this the other night. We always have bedtime snack. As I mentioned, I had a kid who'd fallen off the growth chart. He was needs that bedtime snack. Um, and it's just part of it. It could be any food snack, Um, and it's just part of it. It could be any food. Sometimes it's ice cream. It was, and all of a sudden our one of the kids was I don't know. I was like what is wrong with him? What is wrong with him? He is being a nightmare. He won't stop talking, he's running in circles, he's like doing acrobatics on the bed, Like what is going on. And I realized that the only ice cream we had had, a it was like mint chocolate chip. We know this kid is very sensitive to caffeine, including the caffeine in chocolate. Oh my gosh. And I was like I can't believe we accidentally gave him this ice cream. Worst decision on the planet.
Speaker 2:Sure.
Speaker 1:Okay, other kid not sensitive to caffeine or chocolate no effect whatsoever. Is it going to affect your kid? Probably not. Had we given them all vanilla?
Speaker 2:ice cream? No, if it is, yeah, if it is, it's probably not even the thing that you think it is.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, exactly. Now that kid like chocolate in the evening. He knows he's not allowed to have it. So he's like sorry man, we can have chocolate in the evening. He knows he's not allowed to have it.
Speaker 2:So he's like sorry man.
Speaker 1:we can have chocolate in the afternoon, I mean not in the evening.
Speaker 2:All adults get too much caffeine, but there definitely are those among us. My brother can pound a Coca-Cola an hour before bed or in bed and just be gone. My wife drinks caffeine after 3 pm.
Speaker 1:She's cooked, so I think this is probably the same with other people. I literally cannot have, I cannot even have chocolate, I can't have any caffeine any part of the day and still be normal at this point.
Speaker 2:There you go. So we have to know, we have to trust our bodies in the same way. So, okay, so then next. Next question this is kind of my last one, but I do want, just before we get here, so that you can also be answering and thinking at the same time, which is impossible, but you know, I'm going to make you do it the, the. How do we, how do we introduce? If you had to give us like five steps or six steps, or if you have them, how do you introduce your kids to new foods? I want to get to that in a second, but my last one is my toddler seems to go through periods where he doesn't eat at all. My toddler also goes through periods where he seems like he will eat the rug. Um, normal, Should I be?
Speaker 1:concerned, 100% normal. Now, if your child truly is eating nothing, as in not one bite at every meal, that's not normal Generally. That would be a time to just check in, potentially with a pediatrician or something Like when a child is not eating anything, that's actually when I recommend like hey, call up, call a local professional, just to get a gut check on this, Cause that's not normal. Um, but your toddler eating almost nothing one day and eating literally as much or more than you ate, is very typical, extremely typical.
Speaker 2:Or like front ending Every parent has experienced. So like front end loading kids who will not eat after like two, like this is what goes for us. I would never say that my my middle one, doesn't eat at all. He's the one who does this more than my other two. He doesn't like not eat at all, but he'll not eat after 2 PM.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's super, super typical Cause they're tired. Well, we don't realize it takes a lot of energy to eat. You got to sit, you got to focus, you have to, like, coordinate your body, you have to chew and swallow and breathe and deal with any sort of food neophobia you have or, you know, anxiety related to eating pressure that your parents are putting on you. It's a lot. We don't realize just how much it is, how much of an energy thing it is for kids to eat. So, so, if your child is like you know they're, they may get to 2 PM and they're, like, ready for nap time, or maybe they don't have a nap, but they're still technically really could use the nap. Sure, or they've been in daycare all day or school day or whatever, and they're coming home they're tired, they're done, they've already eaten their food. In which case I just recommend cause parents are then like oh my gosh, they didn't eat any vegetables today Start serving the vegetables at breakfast.
Speaker 2:Wow this sounds crazy.
Speaker 1:Start serving the foods that you wish they would eat earlier in the day and then you'll be blessed.
Speaker 2:Okay, so this is. This is step one. So I've done this intuitively. But that's funny that you say that, because I'll like, sort of like, an omelet with vegetables, and my kid will eat it for breakfast. Yeah, not going to touch it at dinner. Okay so, top five tips or steps or whatever, however you'd frame it. We got five minutes. How can I get my kid to eat some more foods? And then I want to make sure people know how to connect with you so that they can get all this information and more.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So first thing we've been talking about this a lot as the parent get in your brain what your job is, which is to serve the food, and it's their job to decide whether or not to eat it. If you have this mindset, you open up a lot of opportunities for yourself. The second thing is to actually serve the food that you want your child to eat. That might mean serving foods that you know your child is not going to eat. So don't make that much, because you're going to be eating a lot. Don't put a cup of peas on their plate. Put one pea on their plate. Use micro portions that's what I call them and I like that. But you've got to have the food there, right there, until they see it and become familiar with it. They're, until they see it and become familiar with it, they're not going to eat it.
Speaker 2:Third is to model yourself what you want your child to be doing Modeling is so powerful as with everything, right, no pressure on us.
Speaker 1:Um, yeah, eat together, but eat the foods. Eat the foods you want your child to eat with them. Show them how to do it. The other thing is to um, uh, you know, make, make your mealtime a little bit fun when you can. I mean, my husband is like so notorious for like picking up a, a stick of broccoli and singing into it like a microphone or you know, you can just make it light, right, because the more fun kids have, the more they relax, and when they're relaxed, they're less likely to be anxious, and when they're less anxious, they're more likely to eat something. And they're watching you and they're having fun and you just ate this green bean in a really funny way. Maybe they want to do that too. Do not underestimate the power of a little bit of fun, and quote playing with way. Maybe they want to do that too. Do not underestimate the power of a little bit of fun, and quote playing with food. We don't want to be wasting food, but we can still play with food.
Speaker 2:I love that.
Speaker 1:And, um, I guess the the other, I mean those are like the really core that was four. I came up with four on the spot. The other one, I would say, something that's also really powerful, is to have um, is to kind of incorporate kids into the eating experience or like cooking, meal prep, any of that.
Speaker 2:I was actually about to ask this Cause you said this. You said something like this with the, with the Z bars, you were like, look, this is the budget here, here's the other things we have to buy. And I was in my head. I was like, oh man, I'm glad you're saying this now, because I thought in the moment, like, oh man, I I grocery shop with my kids, but do I have a conversation about? Like we are eating this tonight in the same way that I would with my wife when we're walking around? I'm like doesn't this asparagus look good, let's try this.
Speaker 1:Like right why?
Speaker 2:would never do that with my kids.
Speaker 1:That conversation with your kid you can also say hey, do you see any orange vegetables? Do you see any? Hey, can you go pick out some fruit for us to try this week, or you? Can say for yourself hey, can you go pick up some fruit for me to try, for me to try? You don't have to put the pressure on your child, um, so, anyway, there's a cooking meal. Prep, of course like having kids in the kitchen while you're making food is tricky, and I 100% get that.
Speaker 1:Like baking with my kids is a hard no.
Speaker 2:My wife, my wife is not a fan. I'll do it, I'll totally do it, but my wife is like no, no way.
Speaker 1:Just kind of know yourself, know the situation, read the room, the whole thing. But when kids are in the kitchen, I'm like I love giving my kids like things that are pushing their ability to like hit danger. My kids are all about danger. I have stereotypical boys, so you give them a knife. Now, obviously, this requires a lot of supervision, know your own child, et cetera, all the warnings, Um. But you give my kids a knife all of a sudden. They will help prep the meal because they could also chop off their finger. Now, granted, I'm not going to give them a knife, they could chop off their finger.
Speaker 2:but this feels, but maybe that they could cut themselves and that's actually okay.
Speaker 1:Exactly, and they don't want to cut themselves. My kids cut themselves on knives Absolutely, but like not that bad, and they become extremely careful with knives. Um, and it's actually not been during food prep that they've cut themselves. They took my paring knife and they turned it into a whittling knife.
Speaker 2:Whittling is, I would say whittling, for in my own personal experience of whittling, I have gotten more stitches from whittling, for in my own personal experience of whittling, I have gotten more stitches from whittling than any other single activity. So facts, facts on facts can confirm.
Speaker 1:So anyway, including your kids and meal prep, those are kind of the five that I really look at. How do you put this all together? And that's um, that's it.
Speaker 2:I love, I love those five. I feel like I'm going to be implementing those five this week for my family, literally tomorrow, because I feel like this conversation has given me a completely different view of food and eating and some stuff that I can do. I love this micro portions thing. I'm always like just take one bite, but I've never thought about only putting one bite on the plate. I'm always like just take one bite, but it's like do you know how much broccoli I eat as a vegetarian? Like my plate is like looks like a forest, which probably is going to give me that.
Speaker 2:Like you know, I it's like going to mess with my iron or something, but but you know, I think that that's super, super helpful. And so, all of these tips, I'm going to go back and listen to this episode myself. My wife who, who, who listens to the podcast occasionally was like wait, wait, wait, when's this one coming out? And I was like. I was like Jess, you can have, you can have the preview, you can have it on the computer before it comes out, cause she's going to listen to this in eight minutes. She's going to be like take the kids.
Speaker 1:Hot tip Don't say take one bite, because does it work. Does it work.
Speaker 2:No, it doesn't work. Are you kidding me?
Speaker 1:Doesn't work.
Speaker 2:The only thing that seems to work is you can spit it out. Oh, you can spit it out.
Speaker 1:Perfect Right I love. Hey, you can eat it when you're ready. You don't have to eat it, because when you say you have to take a bite, I don't know about you, my kids, are like. Nope, but if you're like. Oh, I don't care, I don't care, I don't care. You might really care, but pretend like you don't care, and then they're like oh okay, you don't care, so I'll do whatever I want, which might be to take a bite.
Speaker 2:Right, and I mean, yeah, the fact that the table is a place where I mean physically so many parents this is a totally another episode, but so many parents need to give their kids so much more autonomy because so many behavior issues come from. I have to get my autonomy out in some way and if you don't give me an outlet, I'll find one. But I think the dinner table is often one where it's like I mean, a lot of parents have really problematic parenting practices. I don't know a single parent today who's going to hold their kid down and shove food in their mouth and thank God, by the way but but because of that, it's sometimes the only place where a kid feels like I have control and we know, right from eating disorder research, a lot of it's about control and so understanding that you can give yourself and your kids an agent, a sense of agency and control man, I like that a lot.
Speaker 2:This has been so helpful. What? Where can we find you, other than obviously, kids eat in color, which I imagine many people who are listening have already, have already experienced you. But you know you mentioned that there's a, there's a picky eating, picky eating screener and things like that. Where can we find all that stuff? How can we get in touch with you?
Speaker 1:I mean the, if you go to kids in colorcom or even the um or even the, you know Instagram link whatever all the all the bio links. Um, the picky eating screeners, that we have some free picky eating guide. That's really good. It's super helpful, Like here's the basics of, to help get your picky eater started on the right track. So those are two things that I highly recommend.
Speaker 2:Do you have a link? Do you have a link to that that we can just put in the show notes for people? Oh yeah, absolutely Awesome. Okay, We'll put that in the show notes so that you can just go right.
Speaker 1:Well, her the website, kids eating color, will also be there. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, okay, how else. Yeah, how else. How else can we get in touch?
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, I mean that's. That's pretty much type type in kids in color. See what comes up.
Speaker 2:Here you are.
Speaker 1:The website, the social media media.
Speaker 2:Those are like the big, those are the big places I love it yeah I on behalf of, uh, my own personal family, but also on behalf of all of the people with picky eaters and all the toddler parents who feel so much better after listening to this. Jennifer, thank you so much for being on the whole parent podcast absolutely thanks for having me wow was I not right like?
Speaker 2:this is one of the best episodes that we have ever had on the whole parent. Absolutely. Thanks for having me. This has been a total struggle and, like I said, I'm recording this intro and now the outro, which you're listening to right now, a couple of days after, and I've implemented this stuff since then and it has been so, so helpful. In fact, I even sent an email about it last week and that's what I wanted to tell you about.
Speaker 2:If you are listening to the whole parent podcast on a regular basis but you're not on the email list yet, you got to get on the email list why? Because I send out a really, really informative, helpful email about parenting every single Thursday, and that email includes things like my tips for helping your kids to become a little bit less picky with what they eat, Stuff that I learned from people like Jennifer, stuff that I learned from other guests that we have. And so if you're on that email list, great. If you're not, go to the link in the description of this episode, go to the show notes and click on that first link. It goes to my email landing page or email list landing page. You can enter your information in there. I'm not going to spam you with a bunch of like buy this, buy this. I'm not gonna sell your data to anybody, nothing like that.
Speaker 2:The email list is just your way to stay connected with all things whole parent and especially to get that extra parenting advice that you might need. And we don't always have time to listen to every single podcast, but on Thursday you know that you're going to get an email that's going to help you parent better every single Thursday. So, without further ado, I'm going to end this episode because it's already been one of my longest episodes ever. I'm glad that it was one of my longest episodes ever because it's one of the most chocked full of good information, helpful information, like I've said, that I've already started to apply in my own life with my own kids. It's been super, super life-changing for us so far. So that's all I got for you today. Thanks for listening to the Whole Parent Podcast and I'll see you next time.
